MOVIE TRAILERS

Cant wait

Hey Zack, ur a dumbass

I just hate how every time someone criticizes Christianity, it is because of freaking idiots in the faith. They showed Robert Tilton (an idiot televangelist), who, in no wise, is even close to being what the Christian faith prescribes. That said, I will see this because it would be good to se the criticisms of the faults in the people of the Christian faith.

This is going to piss off so many people. I can't wait.

i love bill maher, love the show too. can't wait.

This looks fun. Being that LionsGate also distributes the DVD "The Case for Christ" by Lee Strobel, I wonder where this film is going to go. Looks like it will be a very interesting exploration. Meanwhile watch "Gary Zamora - The Devil Gave Me a Flat Tire" on YouTube here http://youtube.com/watch?v=C8LV0kOatvg Peace, ya'll.

finally giving religion the laugh it deserves

I'm buying a ticket!

Opiate Crutch!

" Hey look…it's Bill Maher looking smug with some editing that brings out the "ironic" in all his questions. How original! Guess there are no normal religious people in this world who aren't crazy or who don't want to kill everyone." Quoted for truth. " OH YEAH!!!! I would drive to another state to see this if I had to…this looks to be doing what desperately needs to be done…show religion for the opiate crutch that it is…if people didnt take themselves and religion so seriously the world would be a much safer and calmer place to live…" Where have I heard that before....Trying to remember who embraced such a ideology...hmm, oh wait yes Communism. Yeah that worked out real well. Because people beliving in a set of moral values is terribly wrong, or people wanting to believe they are part of something bigger then themselves. But its much more fun to stereotype people based on the wacko's that are probably mentally handicap to begin with.

Not really interested in hearing Bill Maher's take on anything.

"When people make movies like this I wonder if they've ever contemplated what a world would be like where no one believed in a God." Richard, quite a lot of people have and many of them conclude that a world without belief in god(s) would be a significantly better place. I've written quite a few articles on just that subject in a series I've called "A Better Life Without God: What Atheism Offers," which are on my site. But the short answer is, there's a strong argument to be made that a world without faith would be kinder, more compassionate, and considerably less violent.

Or..... we can think about what Human Nature has brought to the world. Death. Death. Death. Death. Death. and more Death. People blame everything else except themselves for everything else. Thats also human nature. I think we just need to get over it. Humans just aren't capable of solving all the world's problems. Everyone getting along is a pointless endeavor, especially if you are using films to blame the rest of the world for your problems with them. Common Sense is not a term that can be used anymore. Neither is right or wrong. I believe in God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit and the Holy Trinity. But I WILL NOT use that as a crutch to try and take an advantage in life, nor to blame the problems which i have created in my own life or someone elses.

I can't wait to see this. I just finished reading "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins. Fantastic piece of literature. Since I am a recovering Catholic, it's taken me a long time to get religion out of my head and I am now a better person. I say question everything.

Number 4 said it all. I have got 2 see this.

In the trailer, Bill Maher is talking to Andrew Newberg in Grand Central Station. The trailer says Newberg is the authoer of the book WHY WE BELIEVE WHAT WE BELIEVE, but he's a neuroscientist at the University of Pennsylvania--the guy who does brain scans of nuns, buddhists, atheists, and pentecostals as they speak in tongues. I'm dying to know what his take is on all this religulous-ness. Anyone know?

hah hah, the true meaning of christianity???? thats not around anymore lol, its dead, everyone else is just doing what some old man at the front of a sanctuary is telling them to, no one is making their own opinions and actually realizing that science has been proven, not a single thing in the bible is possible or has any proof of being possible other than the fact that the bible says it does, its just a worn out fiction book thats been on a endless best sellers list, i think its time that people actually see this and see the true light, dont get me wrong, im all for what religion stands for, but humanity has gradually lost it

lol really, an intimate relationship, i told you im all for what religion means and what its supposed to be, but people have lost that, many only believe because of a fear of going to hell, and honestly think, god has no influence in our lives, we do, we control our lives by the choices we make and how we cary ourselves by our beliefs of right and wrong, there is no divine intervention

I have seen the entire movie a few times and it is amazing how people who do documentaries on Christianity never interview capable people who can more than adequately respond to the questions that are being asked. Bill puts down religion but his arguments are self refuting because in reality his world view on religion can be classified as a belief or religion in and of itself. It's like a person who says they don't have an opinion... well not having an opinion is in fact an opinion in and of itself. Bill not believing in religion is in fact his belief, his world view or his religion. I would also ad that whoever did the research for this documentary really did not do a very good job at all. Some of the information that is given is not accurate or complete. A lot of his arguments are weak or what we call in logic "straw man arguments." As far as Christianity is concerned, if Bill was really serious about searching for the truth or if he really wanted to find answers, he would of interviewed people that were more than capable of doing so.

Maggy is a genious lol, i completely agree

"Bill not believing in religion is in fact his belief" NO! Disbelief is the opposite of Believing, and this is why you still believe in a god. you can not think logically.

lol, we think of ourselves as our own gods, thats because this is our life, we have to rise up and live it, we cant fallback on some god, because they wont do anything for us , the way you live your life is by your decisions, god is the oldest urban legend. soon like all other religions that died out, people will realize that its all illogical, most everything said in the bible is either untrue or irrevelant, and there is no proof for anything it says, people need to move on

I've always been of the opinion that insanity runs rampant with religiousness. In my family alone there are Mormons, Jahova's, Catholics, Jews, Seventh Day's, New Agers and Born Again's. They are all nuts. The only Atheist in my family gave me some perspective. So does Bill.

I love the fact that almost every argument made here against Bill Maher comes specifically from Christians. This movie covers all of the religions you delusional zealots. He isn't attacking any faith, he simply is stating his opinions. Obviously those opinions are that these followers are not the most intelligent people around, and every person who has tried to argue against him on this page only adds fuel to the fire. As many people have already stated on this page, some of the most kind and giving people I know don't follow any faith. They are perfectly capable of being humane and having set morals without some preacher telling scaring them into having those morals. I have studied judaism, protestant and catholic Christianity but have found no reason to continue wasting my time with those beliefes because they cause people to be so close minded about life. When asked "What would this world be like without religion?" I respond with my honest belief. I believe that this world would be much more advanced than it is now. Hundreds of years ago our ancestors dreamt that we would have flying cars and be some eutopian society by now. But then religion comes and tells all of those incapable of thinking for themselves that science is a tool of the devil made to cause disbelief in "A" god.

About time someone had the courage to expose all this this religious nonsense. What a joke that in the 21st century people still believe in all this hokus pokus.

sheesh...what next?

After all is said and done, Bill Maher (God bless him!) will not be remembered for very long in the scheme of things, and God and His Word will continue humming along. Faith is proverbial, and people have to begin to wonder why that is so. Is it simply our weakness, or are we, in fact, wired to believe. And if so, why? If an atheistic universe is so obvious and our "natural" evolution so devoid of God, then why does "God" keep coming into the human equation time after time after time? This is what people like Bill M. don't want to face: the distinct possibility that we humans may be born to believe. It's like a little bit of Read-Only Memory from the Creator of the Universe...

I'm sure at some point, they said that about Zeus, Ra, and Baal too. Yahweh or Allah (from whichever lens we're viewing it), are always only 1 generation away from being placed on the bookshelves next to the iliad and odysey where the bible and the koran belong. Replace your word "atheistic" with "rationalistic", and ask the same question of any now-defunct religion. The reason my generation is waking up is because religion is dangerous, both in the short term and long term. Short term, people want to kill each other over this nonesense. The religous people that rammed those planes into those buildings were crazy. And it's because they believed in the words in their book. Long-term, issues like birth control and scientific research need addressing. The Catholics don't believe in birth control - great advice for a world that just mushroomed in population from 1 billion to 6.5 in the last 100 years - we will exhaust our resources on this spinning rock. In the end, it's not the war on terror that needs to be focused upon....it's the war against rationalism - religion needs to be exposed for the danger that it presents to our rational species. Bill Mahar is taking this attempt to expose the concept of religion for the nonesense that it is. He'll probably bring it to us with humor, which is how religion should be viewed. Even better, we get to watch it with a butter-popcorn in our hands!!! By the way - I say this as a person raised Christian - went to Christian school from age 5 through college. At age 26, I was the head of Adult-Education for an Episcopal Church. I know the books forward and backward. I am also well read in Harris, Dawkins, Hitchins, and am fully aware of what religion is and isn't.

Can someone tell me what religion we are talking about? All the religion (maybe buddism is the only exception) died and all we have left are political movements using god as cover trying to brainwash folks to follow "the faith" and kill X but save Y, donate money to Z - in other words try to spread their god laws to to other folks who want to have nothing to do with it... Power and money , that whats this is all about. If god exists and allows for torture and killing of little kids (see utube:kids as witches in Nigeria)..I do not want to be a christian. I rest my case....

"In the end, it's not the war on terror that needs to be focused upon….it's the war against rationalism - religion needs to be exposed for the danger that it presents to our rational species." by William (#55) This is very true, but the fundamental problem, at least in America and I suspect a lot of other places around the world, is the lack of understanding of what being rational means and the lack of ability to fundamentally exercise concrete logic. There's a serious lack of education lack of desire to be educated. I find it terribly sad that in a world full of information and communication, that we find ourselves in a state of apathy and stupidity, and yet, the average American would classify himself or herself as "reasonably educated" about the world. Look at the number of people who classify themselves as "educated voters" who really just regurgitate what they saw or read somewhere with no real grasp of what exactly they are talking about. This goes for conservatives, liberals, socialists, libertarians, and pretty much every other possible classification. We, as adults, need to be taking action to raise our children to be rational, thinking, and honorable citizens of the world by leading by example. We need to be open enough to discuss things like religion, morality, and philosophy rationally, calmly, and honestly instead of just "leaving it up to everyone individually." If we keep doing that and expect to somehow miraculously have a world where problems actually get solved, then we are all idiots. Although Bill Maher's movie (looks like it) is funny, satirical, and sarcastic, he brings up a very good point. We shouldn't be afraid to question our beliefs. Questioning the universally accepted idea that the world was flat was once considered to be preposterous and even offensive. Imagine if we had never bothered to test that hypothesis!

sott at the top, God is a jealous God and He takes what we do seriously here on earth. Mock God, and I don't even have one bit of pity for you. You see, if I died today I know I would go to Heaven, What about you??? I would rather believe in Jesus, and find out later that it isn't true, than to disbelieve and find out someday I was wrong. Our nation is in dire need of help. We are what we are, and that is a nation of sinners. But you know we can all be Saints if we choose to be. Why are people so incredibly sarcastic when it comes to God. Just go to http://www.wayofthemaster.com and you will see and hear why those that don't believe Jesus saves, will burn eternally in a lake of fire. I do not want anyone who reads this message to end up there. Do you?? God Bless, Jim Cooke

What Jim C is trying to bring up is the old the Pascal Wager propagated by almost every religioso I've ever met, which reads as follows: it is better to believe in a deity and be wrong than the opposite. The only reason I am wasting time on this is because so many people actually believe that this argument really holds logical water. Jim C is not alone, unfortunately. Here's is just a few of the many flaws in that argument. Firstly, if there is a god who actually cares about what you believe, then how do you know you've picked the right belief system? There are over 4,000 religions in the world. Even amongst Christians, there are hundreds of denominations and sub-denominations many of which are mutually exclusive in their criterion for entrance into heaven. As a matter of probabilities, you've got about a 1/4000 chance of actually picking the right religion much less the right system of orthodoxy. Secondly, if god exists as an omnipresent, omniscient, and omnipotent being, then he/she/it would know if we were just "playing it safe" and condemn those of us who believe otherwise anyway. A person cannot simply choose to believe in something that they frankly don't believe just because it is prudent to do so. Thirdly, if the Christian god as proposed by Christians exists as a merciful and all forgiving god, then how come he/she/it has to resort to scare tactics to win believers? Why would an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent being be forced to reducing himself to such a low-ball technique? Some may respond to this by saying that god gave us free will and wants us to choose. See point #2. Fourthly, if there is no god and you've spent your whole time believing, sacrificing, and doing your supposed god's work, then you HAVE actually lost something. You've lost the time, experiences, and opportunities that you have denied yourself out of a false sense of belief. Here's an idea. Why not live your life honorably and compassionately and concentrate your efforts on making the world a more benevolent, honest, and a better place for the next generation. There's plenty of work to be done in that department on all possible levels. If there is no god or if god really doesn't care about your beliefs, then you will be remembered by those whose lives you have touched by your good deeds and serve as an example to the next generation. If there is a god, and he/she/it is benevolent, then he/she/it will reward you accordingly for improving the lives of your fellow man. If there is a god, and he/she/it is vindictive, then you're screwed anyway.

Finally a movie I can relate to.

LOL - I can't wait for this movie, most of all I hope it isn't done horribly, or it will just drag down the "beliefs" of the atheists out there. Religion makes no sense, you people HAVE to understand that~! Why cant' we believe that the universe is just.. here? why can't you accept that? (because thats crazy!) Well, the idea that god is just here... is JUST AS CRAZY. Pretty funny how a universe just being in existence without a creator is crazy... but having an all-knowing omniscient being who actually gives a rat's ass about humanity exists (oh btw he had no creator either... wow isn't that WEIRD!) We abuse this world, Humans are selfish, religion is SELFISH and we all deserve to die, perish and be completely erased from existence.

Comment 68 was just a test, sorry A good friend of mine suggested I not follow-up at all to comments made in regards to what I said in 61 and 62, followed up by by Elizabeth in 63, and I am not actually resisting his advice, I just wanted to close out what I started and do so in a kind and gentle way. First of all, Elizabeth is a beautiful name. My sister Jana's middle name is Elizabeth and even more importantly is the name Elizabeth in the Bible. You see, the verses in Luke 1, below, tell us a beautiful story of a couple who are to have a son, who would later baptize Jesus in the Jordan river. Whether you believe what I tell you to be true or not isn't the main thing of importance here, b/c no matter what I say to you now, many of those who have commented already are not receptive to God's word, and the only thing that will give you salvation, which in itself is hard to imagine b/c it is a free gift from God, is for the Holy Spirit to convict you of your sin and change your life. You see natural man cannot accept SPIRITUAL THINGS because he/she DOES NOT UNDERSTAND THE WORD. As of right now, I cannot help many of you b/c of this very thing. Answer the question if you comment to this, of What happened to Elizabeth when she heard Mary's greeting that is described in Luke 1:41 way below. After answering the above question, you can if you wish look at the descriptions of the Natural man, the Carnal man, and Spiritual man below, and YOU CAN COMMENT AWAY B/C I MAY READ WHAT YOU SAY, BUT MORE THAN LIKELY, I WILL NOT RESPOND AGAIN. It is only my prayer, heard by God, even if it is in thought only, that gives me hope you may come to understand the thing below. In the name of Christ, who is truly God's son, jim c WHAT THE BIBLE TELLS US OF IS THE NATURAL, CARNAL AND SPIRITUAL MAN. 1 Cor 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. 1 Cor 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. Cor 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. . 1 Cor 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. . 1 Cor 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. . 1 Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 1 Cor 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. But we have the mind of Christ. 1 Cor 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. 1 Cor 3:2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. 1 Cor 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? . 1 Cor 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal? In this sermon out line we see that man lives in a natural body but can live as a natural man or live as a carnal man or can be what God wants all of us to be in our Christian walk and that is a spiritual man. In this outline we look at what the Word says and how we can become a spiritual person walking in the Word and Will of God for our lives. It is only then we can be fulfilled in our lives and be truly happy. I. Let us look first at the NATURAL MAN Paul speaks of in 1 Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. A. First most important HE DOES NOT RECEIVE SPIRITUAL THINGS. 1. Why? It is because he DOES NOT UNDERSTAND THE WORD. 2. The natural man tries to understand God with his five senses. 3. He looks for God with his five natural senses. 4. He considers the things of God as foolishness. 5. It was natural for man to adopt credit buying has had long experience paying now for past sins. II. Paul then tells of the CARNAL MAN WHO IS A BABE IN CHRIST, SAVED BUT NOT MATURE. -1 Cor 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. . A. WORK OF FLESH IS MANIFEST IN THE CARNAL MAN. - 1 Cor 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? - 1. Paul lists the works of the flesh in writing to the Galatians. - Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, - Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, - Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. . B. THE CANNAL MAN USUALLY HAD THE WORD ONLY IN THE HEAD NOT HEART. - Psalms 119:11 Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee. 1. I often say that we need the Word in our: a. Ears, to hear the Word of God. b. In our minds to understand the Word of God. c. In our hearts to believe the Word. d. In our mouths to speak the Word. B. We remain Babes in Christ if we do not grow in the Word. C. God may allow His servant to succeed when He has disciplined him to a point where he does not need to succeed to be happy. The man who is elated by success and is cast down by failure is still a carnal man. At best his fruit will have a worm in it. III. Then Paul tells us of the SPIRITUAL MAN. A. PAUL SAY TO BE SPIRITUAL WE NEED TO BE LED BY GOD'S SPIRIT. - Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. - Gal 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. - Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. - Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. . B. THE SPIRITUAL MAN OR WOMAN WILL BRING FORTH FRUIT; - Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, - Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. . C. THE SPIRITUAL PERSON HELPS OTHERS AS CHRIST ALSO DID. - Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness;considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. . - Gal 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ. 1. The spiritual person will try to bring backsliders back into fellowship with the Lord. 2. He will pray for others. 3. Spiritual people will attend church and be active in the work of God. 4. "A Pharisee is hard on others and easy on himself, but a spiritual man is easy on others and hard on himself." J. Oswald Sanders writing in his book on spiritual leadership said - "If those who hold influence over others fail to lead toward the spiritual uplands, then surely the path to the lowlands will be well worn. People travel together; no one lives detached and alone." (Rom 8:6 KJV) For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. For more help and info go to. http://www.tonyabram.com or to http://www.abundantlifecrusades.com. God bless you and yours. On behalf of this generation, Your friends in the service of Christ, Tony and Marge Abram Abundant Life Crusades http://www.tonyabram.com or go to: http://www.abundantlifecrusades.com Luke 1:5 [ The Birth of John the Baptist Foretold ] In the time of Herod king of Judea there was a priest named Zechariah, who belonged to the priestly division of Abijah; his wife Elizabeth was also a descendant of Aaron. Luke 1:7 But they had no children, because Elizabeth was barren; and they were both well along in years. Luke 1:13 But the angel said to him: "Do not be afraid, Zechariah; your prayer has been heard. Your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you are to give him the name John. Luke 1:24 After this his wife Elizabeth became pregnant and for five months remained in seclusion. Luke 1:36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be barren is in her sixth month. Luke 1:39 [ Mary Visits Elizabeth ] At that time Mary got ready and hurried to a town in the hill country of Judea, Luke 1:40 where she entered Zechariah's home and greeted Elizabeth. Luke 1:41 When Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. Luke 1:56 Mary stayed with Elizabeth for about three months and then returned home. Luke 1:57 [ The Birth of John the Baptist ] When it was time for Elizabeth to have her baby, she gave birth to a son.

Amen to #69 People think they know it all, when GOD knows all. Why think, when HE knows? I just wanted to comment and say that GOD loved us so much to come down to our earth that he is outside of and put on human flesh, JESUS CHRIST, and beared our sins, just to give us a way to heaven, GOD wishes that no man perish and go to hell. I hope the HOLY SPIRIT convicts hearts of the unrepented lost souls. GOD BLESS

So they should really call this movie "Dumb People Believe In God Too". From what I've gathered Maher has failed to interview people with more knowledge of the Bible than your average joe. All he did was make dumb people look dumb which can be done on any topic. Rather than pose the question to well rounded individuals he simply abused the minds of religious freaks who are easier to dominate with rhetoric. The movie is supposed to be funny, but allowing people to make competent rebuttals is far less amusing than "Go to Hell Devil-Man". I guess yet another title for this movie could be "Bill Maher Pats Himself on the Back for 90 Minutes".

Respectfully to DoGoodinNC, and others who share his beliefs: It is literally word for word, actually; without exaggeration or inaccuracy (definition of literally taken from dictionary.com) amazing how hurt and bitter the world has made you become. God created you, me, and all other living beings on this planet, and we are not accidents nor are we accidentally here. He does give us all the ability to choose and we do so based on our environments and other things that HAVE GIVEN US OUR OWN WORLDVIEW. If the Holy Spirit intervenes in a life and that life responds then that person's life can be changed forever. I, personally cannot speed up this process for any man, woman, or child, but I can pray hoping what the Holy Spirit can truly bring a person comes upon you in a way it has not, as of yet. God is good always, regardless of how we feel about it. I could give you my life testimony, but right now is not the time. What John S. says above can be grasped but you have to believe and there has to be divine intervention. Knowing not all things, but knowing Jesus saves, I love you, jim c.

JUST saw the movie - It was exactly what this country needs, a poke in the ribs, a good laugh - at itself. Then a serious, "NO, seriously, you ARE crazy and need to stop". Between this and Zeitgeistthemovie dot com - I am ready to give up the ship and move far far away from the land of the "free".

Saw it last night, one of the best documentaries that ive even seen.

[And why does Bill Maher spend so much time trying to downgrade other's beliefs? I let him have his lack of beliefs. I grieve for his lost soul. BCT on Oct 1, 2008] If there were souls, u'd have lost yours long ago due to your religion, what you are saying there is exactly what the Christian religion does to non-believers: Convert. If you really cared about others, you would let them have free will and choose their beliefs instead of scaring them with notions of going to hell if one doesn't believe in "THE SAVIOR" pshh fuck your religion and your evil ways. you guys piss me off everyday with your crap.

David W., you are as crazy of a lunatic as I have ever read. In his famous book Mere Christianity, C.S. Lewis makes this statement, "A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic - on the level with a man who says he is a poached egg - or he would be the devil of hell. You must take your choice. Either this was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us." http://www.greatcom.org/resources/whoisjesusorig/lordliarlunatic.html I am giving you a link here to a site that can give you information. What you do with that information is totally up to you. Your life will not be changed if your heart is hard, and the Holy Spirit does not bring you to God. I pray for your salvation. There is a real HELL and there is a real HEAVEN and I know someday I will be in Heaven with all of the other overcomers. I hope you are there with me. jim c.

David, this is actually kind of fun. You seem so angry and I am laid back, calm, and relaxed. And me deciding to spend my time alone with God in peace and wonder and tranquility IS? how, when, and where you spend your time with God is between you and Him. The Bible does though want us to worship corporately. It says so in scripture. I apologize for the name calling. That is not really me! The great commission: http://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/the-great-commission.htm - well it is for all believers to carry out. You see I believe in miracles, I am one myself. And you are as well. You were known by God while you were still in your mother's womb. Now you are out in the real world and things have upset you and the Holy Spirit's intervention is not evident right now. Jesus is not everyone's Savior, only those who believe and receive His gift of eternal life. You see God/Jesus are no respectors of persons. They would want all to come to repentance but there has to be a real life change ignited by the fire inside, the Holy Spirit. I love you man, and so does Jesus, but you are off base when it comes to understanding His ways and His truths. Sincerely, jim c.

David, you have some fairly decent inquisitions, but you are wrong on several things. First of all, we, as Christians today, should live just as Christians did in Jesus' day if not on a greater level because of a faith, a faith where Christians of Jesus' day could see and touch God in the flesh. I am excited to interact with you even if only over the technology super highway, it is really a pleasure. I would though love to meet you and visit face to face, but I don't know if that is in His plan or not. As to knowing the difference between being saved and being born again, I don't know where you came up with that one, but I know the difference pretty well. I only wish that you were receptive to the real message of life saving eternal life that Jesus again gives us freely if we are willing and able to receive it. We, as Christians have been saved, are being saved, and will be saved. We are told to work out our salvation, and this is basically a continual process. And I can say I am fleshing it out even as I process this message. Our, Christians, being born again, refers to a rebirth that only takes place b/c of our receiving Jesus Christ as our Savior and Lord, but again for Jesus to be Lord it has to or should be evidenced in our everyday walk with Christ. You definitely have some interesting things to say, and I hope you return to your first love that could have been Jesus, though I am not sure, so that you can have eternal life and have it in abundance. In Christ, Jim Cooke

Could someone contact me if they want to share understanding? jkelly104@cox.net

Jim, you say I am wrong on several things. Based on what? My contradiction of a book that has been proven extremely fallible in all areas except archeology? And the only reason it is so is because religious experts of the ages even immediately after Moses’ day decided to alter the wordings of things a little bit here and there, because things it said didn’t make sense to them. The only thing you did mention is that WE, Christians (as if I would call myself such a thing, now that WE have completely destroyed its original meaning ) should live as the Christians lived in Jesus day only to a greater degree? OK then, go sell everything you own and give away all your money to the poor, if that is what you REALLY believe. That’s what the REAL church did in the first century. But you won’t, because you don’t really believe in Jesus more than they did and I am certain that it is considerably less than they did. I know my faith is considerably less than that, and it seems mine is greater than yours, since I seem understand much deeper issues than you appear to. You say that you would love to met me in person, I don’t think you would enjoy that very much, because you would fail to re-enslave me to the same religious vampirism that has turned you into one of the undead. And I’ll bet your excited to interact with me you’ve probably never met anyone else like me, someone who knows the truth behind the truth. The difference between being saved and being Born Again is so simple and easy the religious have done everything they can to destroy that difference. Because if people really knew what it was and then believed it during this life, it would destroy their power over them. But the religious must have that power, it’s the Holy Spirit of their God, MONEY. The difference is this . . . . EVERYONE is Saved, but only a few are Born Again. Being Born Again is a choice that no one is able to make, God decides it. Does it say that no one comes to Son unless the Father draws him? Or does it say that God asks you to come to the Son if you only feel like it? The Book of Romans says that there is no Free-Will. How can there be Free-Will if God predestinated everyone’s fate like it says? And then it goes on to say that we don’t even have the right to question’s God’s decision to punish the evil people, since He made them to be what they are. What’s Justice in that? The fact of the matter is that it is totally unfair for these things to be true, if Eternal Hell Fire is true too. And if so, then God is an evil beast greater than Devil’s wildest fantasies. But the truth about Hell is that it was made up it came from Babylon and latched itself onto certain parts of Scripture that was gradually tweaked over time to make it appear true. But there other parts of the Bible that they missed that shows this inconsistency, but you really have to be paying attention to notice them. Like in the end every knee will bow and every tongue will confess, that was derived from the verse in Revelations where every creature in the entire universe (Including those in Hell) will be praising God. Now how or even why would a person do that in Hell, their to busy enjoying their torment, I doubt very much that you or I could be praising anyone while screaming in flames forever. You wish that I was receptive to the message of eternal life? You say that like I know even less than you. I already did all the listening to Religious Witchcraft that I care to. You say work out our salvation? Another religious error. You can’t work it out. It’s a free gift. That is another, of so many, altered verse originally designed to mean that you must work out the understanding of its mystery not work out to receive it. And then you say that is only WE Christians that are saved. How arrogant, You just shown me that you, like the rest of them, don’t have the slightest desire to help anyone and that your sole biases for believing what you believe is because you want to be served rather than to serve, in fact you want a God that will impersonate a “Well, I’ll show them.” type of thing. At the root of a typical modern Christian’s heart is a desire for revenge on what they perceive as the wicked. They subconsciously and sometimes not so subconsciously want people to pay for enjoying their lives, while their not supposed to, even though secretly they do the same things, but then that just feeds into their desire to punish the wicked more, so that they can feel better about their own sin. YOU TALK LIKE I DON”T KNOW THIS ABOUT YOUR KIND? Jim, I'm sorry, but I'm done talking to you. You don't even understand your own Religion. And Dan, I wouldn't mind discussing a few things with you, but removing intelligent design from the universe is a hard pill to take, Science has been unable to do that, even Bill Maher’s favorite atheist Scientist reluctantly admitted that intelligent design is an indisputable fact

To: David Weiser I wouldn't mind emailing or chatting about understanding. jkelly104@cox.net

David, sorry you have to go to work today, I just had an enjoyable meal after a wonderful Sunday School session with my family. It is good that you have a chance to vent, but your going around in circles is sorta amusing. You see, the New Testament was originally written in Greek, and realize I know enough about scripture and a lot, a whole lot about God and His working in my life as well as His working in your life. I also know that the original text of the Old Testament is Hebrew, and God Brew it among men so that what they wrote very great words of wisdom for us all to understand, but your lack of understanding and wanting to understand is what drives you away from a MOST LOVING GOD. God bless your entire life, Jim Cooke

No more than "God" or "It" can control the storms, war or the holocausts, can "It" have emotions. If "It" existed at the beginning of time (14B years ago,) then "It" preceded life. Point is "It" is not a "person," therefore, "It" cannot talk to people or in any other way communicate to us. Much can be explained as coincidence. Energy existed at the "beginning." Energy exists today. There is original energy and life made energy. "Cave men" used kinetic energy with the wheel. Even the first form of life (the squiggly asexual single cells in a pool of water) needed energy. The dinosaurs had energy. What makes a heart beat? Water has much to do with life. It is a sustenance. All humans lived in their mother's water "bag" prior to birth. Dan Kelly

David, Dan, and all other seekers, Just go to http://www.wayofthemaster.com and pay close attention following all instructions and get back with me. Thanks, in sincere Christian kindness, jim c. just curious David, do you live in a Bible belt state or where?

Dan, I do feel as if I want to dialogue with you more, and I will. You have given your e-mail address and I will share with you mine, if you do want to have dialogue, reciprocal conversation. Sincerely, jim c. by the way what state are you in, i'm in tx., are you in a Bible belt state???

One more thing I would like to blog. When I was a kid I modeled myself after J.C. until I had knowledge of sin which happened to be after the age of 7. Later, I wanted to become a priest but I found out you had to be an Italian to be Pope (European, I suppose, after the last two.) "God" forgive me; I think the current "God's" representative on earth is a Nazi. Totally "Religuous!."

David, there are 19 possible Bible states in the 2nd paragraph below: I am from Texas, and you are from _________. I am 45 years old, have literally just recently been resurrected not literally but figuratively from a 40 year funk of sorts including much depression, and if there isn't a living, loving God, who is my Savior, and all that call upon Him, check out Romans 10:8-13; God who is righteous but is also jealous of anything we put in front of Him, God who judges the wickedness of man and who will dish out eternal punishment to all who do not believe in Him......... In His loving name, jim c. God Bless He finds two belts, one more eastern that stretches from central Florida through Alabama, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia, North and South Carolina, and into Virginia, and another that is more western, moving from central Texas to the Dakotas, but concentrated in Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana, Oklahoma, Missouri, Kansas and Mississippi. In terms of demographics, the belt can accurately be described as extending westward to include most of West Texas and Eastern New Mexico, and perhaps even farther into areas of southern New Mexico settled by Texans. Additionally, the southern parts of Nebraska, Indiana, and Ohio are sometimes included.

I haven't read the entire debate because it is too similar to the same debate you see throughout the "christian" blogs. I also have not visited any of the sites that you each have offered. But I'll say this. David W. you are correct on many points. Jim C. is referring to the clever "lord, liar or lunatic" argument that some Christians have used to "prove" that Jesus was Lord, since He didn't meet their predefined definition of liar or lunatic. In addition, they only give you three choices - liar, lord or lunatic. To the unthinking, this makes perfect sense and so it serves their purpose well. Now understand that I am not saying that Jesus is not God. I am not arrogant enough to imply that I know either way. But I am saying that there is a sort of elitist attitude among many who call themselves christians even though they act in ways that Jesus himself would never act. And that is really the barometer by which anyone who calls him or herself a "Christian" needs to measure him or herself. Many do not even come close unfortuneately and this goes for every religion. For example, if jim c was truly following the teaching of the Christ, he would not be trying to anger or antagonize you but trying to help you see that you are right on many of your points. But you need to let go of the negativity associated with your point f view. Create love. Create postive energy and see http://www.bottomlineredefined.com. He offers you an "I love you man" but he really doesn't love you or he wouldn't treat you the way he just did. I think if you considered your true feelings jim you would agree. This is typical of so many who believe that they are "enlightened" and that god speaks through them. Don't let it bother you. In fact, love them until they see things correctly. They are not bad people, just mis informed like many, many people who have been used and abused by organizations that actually create this atmosphere. For now, jim c., I suggest you think about the feelings you have when you "offer" advice and "love" to people like David. Jesus was pretty clear about this if you have ever read his teachings, which you may have. It is even more disturbing that these things get passed down to our children. We start them out in life creating negative feelings towards those who don't think the same way we do and that is dangerous, not just for those who are born into other religions and recieve their negativity, but for the very spirit and soul of us and our children. That should scare all of us.

Jim, I too, am 45 years old. I’ve seen things both in and out of the church that I wish I didn’t. In my walk with Christ mostly against my own Will. I’ve combat and have been victorious over insanity, depression, several physical debilitations, including blindness, war, poverty. I have seen some of the worst horrors and greatest wonders this life has to offer. And I have seen things from beyond this world both heavenly and hellish. I know what I know and I don’t need the links of regurgitated hypersters to make my points. I apologe for how arrogant much of this sounds but above all and most importantly I am humbled in my soul that a nobody like me has seen and experienced such things. And That’s what I am, a nobody, and that’s why God (Jesus) loves me, because I am a Nobody and any part of me that might appear to be something, It’s not mine, but His. And the reason I am so frustrated with you and others like you, is that you are not being real with me or any of the rest of us. Please stop referring me to these links of religious regurgitated hype and lies. I would love to hear what You think about your faith. Tell me what you believe in Jim. Because that’s what it is all about. What do YOU believe? And from there we can begin an intelligent discussion, without the posturing, the sarcasms, and the agitations. At least from me. I would feel more at ease with you. And I would likely let you just believe whatever you believe I would state whether or not I agree and why, but without the personal jabs, as I have tried to do with Dan and your Son. So why don’t we do that? Let’s be real with each other. And have an intelligent and informed conversation here. Best wishes, Dave.

Tell me what you believe in Jim! David, first of all thanks for being sincere. My son, more than myself, but I am also guilty, almost laughed at the length of many of your comments. But, I too, put in some long ones. I don't like seeming to be forceful or push my-self on others, but as you have, I have also been around the block a few times. I would not even try to compare any of my life with yours, b/c reading your #109 above, I see some greater pain in yours probably than mine. I don't think we can empathize very well when what you have encountered is not what I have encountered and vice versa. David, your question to me, "What do you believe?" is real. The question is real b/c it requires a real answer from me. And I could go around and around before answering it, but really it isn't that difficult for me to answer. I believe in being real. You see for that literal 40 year funk I wrote about in #105, I lived life in a whole lot of different directions. And when I could not make my life work, I could easily crater, and want to die. Miraculously speaking, God delivered me, and I hope I never return to what I was before His deliverance. I will respect what you have to say, but I know who Jesus is and I will not think any less of you if you don't believe who the real Jesus is or not. Don't try and argue for it will not do either of us any good. I want what is best for you as I also want what is best for me. You will lose your frustrations when you unconditionally surrender to the Real Jesus that lives inside of me. David, these are your words "And the reason I am so frustrated with you and others like you, is that you are not being real with me or any of the rest of us. I would love to hear what You think about your faith. Tell me what you believe in Jim. Because that’s what it is all about. What do YOU believe? And from there we can begin an intelligent discussion, without the posturing, the sarcasms, and the agitations. At least from me. I would feel more at ease with you. And I would likely let you just believe whatever you believe I would state whether or not I agree and why, but without the personal jabs, as I have tried to do with Dan and your Son. So why don’t we do that? Let’s be real with each other. And have an intelligent and informed conversation here." I will adhere to your rules above to the degree my Jesus wants me too. Smiling and feeling totally at peace, jim c. there are some songs I am thinking about and if you mention to me something about them next time I will link you up

David, you are wearing me out, but in a way that I still want to help you. I am by nature a helping person. Long ago, I wanted to rescue everyone, but that is not possible for my or you or any human being. As I was reading your first paragraph I thought please don't write too much, but then I scrolled and there are still a lot of words. I don't believe the things you wrote are laughable. You want to believe I think that way, but that is b/c you want your way in this matter. I may have linked you to professionals, but I am just a layperson. Nothing more, except for the fact God/Jesus/the Holy Spirit have gifted me with more than what some people may get gift wise. But I need to watch what I do and say, and I haven't done a great job in some of my postings, b/c to be honest I found most people writing here, AND YOU ARE NOT ONE OF THEM, to be lame and impenetrable, in terms of God's Holy Spirit. Unless, you or I or anyone else for that matter allows the Holy Spirit to work through them, than all else is matterless. Please do not be offended b/c that is the furthest thing from what I want to do. You see, David, my saying I am real, means I am authentic just as you can be authentic, and authentic what? An authentic Christian believer. You can in your very own den, kitchen, living room, or bedroom, or bathroom, pray to receive Jesus Christ as your personal Savior and Lord. I cannot make you do that, I cannot do it for you, YOU HAVE TO DO IT FOR DAVID, and you cannot do it unless you have a childlike faith that believes in what some people call is make believe. Jesus is real, He lived on this earth, born of a virgin mother, b/c the Holy Spirit placed Him within Mary, He was born, raised as a child of parents, but He was without sin. He lived a perfect life. He had a trade that He learned from his earthly father, but He knew also of His heavenly father, God, and as he grew in wisdom and in stature He sought continually God's will. He died on the cross carrying every sin we ever committed with him in his death, but the WE here is believers/Christians. I am forgiven and you can be forgiven, if you ask and believe and receive Jesus. I pray that you would accept what Jesus has for you, but again I cannot do it for you. In the Love of Christ, jim c.

Dear Jim, I just got back from the movies. I watched a horror flick, called Quarantine, another campy Zombie movie kinda ify as far as they go. This is my other day off. I saw Religilous, a few days ago. And I enjoyed it, I find amusing is that people have complained that Bill Maher never ask anyone other than laymen of their faiths anything and maybe a few people only couple of rungs up from them. That was the whole point. Yes, he would have gotten better answers from professionals of the religious faiths he interviewed. But that was not the point that he was trying to make with his movie. He wanted to show and perhaps find out just why people are willing to believe anything just on someone else’s say so. And he did make people look like fools because of it. And you would be, if that was what the reasons were for believe something. I believe in Jesus, not because I read about him or had him preached to me. But because I started to have futuristic dreams and visions about Him not long after I began to seriously listen to what was said about Him. Many of them have come true some are still in the Future. Bill who told you that the Bible was infallible? Maybe the same type who told me. Religious experts with something to gain by lying about it. Hmmm? I beleive such a thing when historical facts have proven it to be other wise? Do you know how many times the Bible had to be rewritten and altered before the Religious and the Royalties of Europe allowed it to be viewed by anyone? This is historical fact. I do not believe that translating scripture detracts from it enough to damage it. But historical documents have proved that Scribes from long ago under orders from religious and political superiors outright altered certain wordings to other words that had similar meanings but in doing so changed the context of passages and sometimes even removed entire phrases and added new ones. Yet, you seem to believe that this is irrelevant? Why? You said “I am not a Biblical scholar, but I know what I know because I know what I know.” That is very telling. How can you be a “Good Christian” and not endeavor to find out everything you can about the only true indisputable relic of your faith? Not only that but saying that you know just because you know. Is utterly meaningless. Do you know because God told you? Sometimes Christians just say that they know becuase they know because it sounds like faith, but really it’s faith in nothing. It’s “I believe just because I do” sort-of-thing. That is a delusion, Jim. I like what you said about having Faith in God and it being all you needed, however it is nice to have that faith confirmed in Scripture. I personally no longer view the Bible as Scripture but as compass pointing toward the real Scripture buried underneath it. I no longer use the Bible to find out what God has said, But I ask God to tell me what the Bible really means or at least how to find out. So the Sheep (believers) go to heaven and the Goats (unbelievers) go to hell for an eternity? Ever ask yourself why is that a necessary thing from God’s perspective? Remember He knew who would go to heaven and hell even before He made the world. And even created them to be evil to show that he had power to do anything He wanted. And no one has a choice about where they will spend eternity that’s in the Book of Romans Chapter 9. And in Ezekiel God says that He created Evil, look it up. Also if the Bible is so inerrant why does God tempt Abraham to Offer up his Son Isaac? When God said “I change not, I am the same Yesterday, today, and forever.” and “Let no man say he is tempted of God, God temps no man.” Yet there He is in Genesis Tempting Abraham to kill his Son. And Later says to Abraham, when He saw that he was about to kill Isaac. He said, “Don’t harm the boy, because now I know that you fear God, and would not withhold the life of your son.” Hmm God, not knowing something? This doesn’t add up, Jim. Something is wrong. here, either the God of the Bible is not the God that the Church has described all this time, or the Scriptures have been poorly translated. And Since I know God, personally, and in spite of the errors of Christendom, they got the right concept of God, mostly. I am inclined to think that the translators of the past, messed up. Either accidentally or deliberately. And now as I explore this dilemma more and more over the years I am discovering that the errors in Translation are becoming more likely a deliberate act of petty power hungry evil men masquerading as Champions of Faith. God will be the Judge of them. Wouldn't be wonderful to know what the Scripitures really say and what these Evil Wolves in Sheep's clothing are hiding from us? I wonder what they are so afraid of. What's hidden in there Jim, what? Dave.

JIm, I just woke up, it was 6:53 AM when I began reading your post. Thank you for the compliment. I see hope here finally. And I agree and about what people must think, but the Spirit of God, spoke to my heart, on it. “It is not for us, but a few others who might see this worked out between us, not for what seems to be the good or bad, by us, but for them who see two brothers of Faith come to greater understandings of truth. To see how the Grace of God can truly Operate in conception." Have you ever been in a face to face religious or Biblical conversations where you can’t really say what you want to say because the other person's personality or yours, or time constraints, detract from the issues. And nothing actually gets resolved but a few small pleasantries in conversation? That can not happen here. The truth will be reached here or one of us will give up trying. Yes, I accidentally called you Bill. Sorry, I was getting sleepy. And I was talking about Bill Maher earlier. So I siad Bill instead of Jim. You said. “Well, you don't want to hear this one again, but I KNOW WHAT I KNOW BECAUSE I KNOW, AND BECAUSE "I AM" TOLD ME SO” Well, now we’re getting somewhere. That is something real. That is something from you. God, told you to believe it. I believe that He did tell you to Believe the Bible. But I don’t believe He told you that it was infallible. Because if He did, then He lied, and since God can’t lie about anything, then I am sorry, it must be you that is. Perhaps unintentionally, I think you might have jumped-the-gun so to speak and went to an error in your conclusion as to what God meant. I have my own reasons for believing that. It so hard to get people to say such things. But I refer you back to earlier questions about the contradictions. I just showed to you in the earlier post that it *Bible* is fallible and how it became so. But you made no mention of an explanation. Other than the brief affirmation of the event of Abraham being tempted mentioned in Hebrews that you posted. Jim I, already know the answer to the dilemma, about Abraham being tempted by God, even though God does not tempt anyone. But I would like to hear it from someone else for a change. Dave.

David, I started this entry by copying and pasting both of your most recent posts here, working backwards basically from the newest one to the earlier one. We could be getting somewhere - I had already looked at your webpage and did not comment on it, b/c I did not feel it to be necessary at the time. You know long ago I believed some things I was experiencing as to be visions/signs from God, but what it was really were ploys of satan to get me off track thinking about something like that. I wanted what happened way back when to really be from God, but it wasn't. BUT I WANTED IT TO BE. I like to define Christian as a "Christ" one or a Christ follower, and that is what I am and you yourself could be one or become one again and possess that distinction for the rest of your life if you so choose to do so. For me, when I was very immature spiritually I wanted things to be my way, and if it wasn't then I pouted. God can and will work and shape and mold you as He has done me for eternity if you let Him. I used to think that if God were real than I would not suffer, and that when I did not feel His presence than He was gone. But in reality when we are or are not in touch with God He is still there. He is always there. Has always been there, and will always be there. In my life I realize when I did not think he was with me it was I who had moved. I am not one bit offended that you basically called me a liar, in that you say God could not have told me the Bible is infallible, but He indeed has let me know that in it's text as we read it, it is as accurate for us as it was for those who wrote it in the first place. There may be some word changes but it still applies to our lives, to the T. I am writing/processing this listening to your music from your myspace. I love the intensity of the Burly Brawl song from the Matrix. I like or liked your musical tastes. I love high intensity things like the music, and I like your choice of a couple of Christian musicians. “It is not for us, but a few others who might see this worked out between us, not for what seems to be the good or bad, by us, but for them who see two brothers of Faith come to greater understandings of truth. To see how the Grace of God can truly Operate in conception." I think I understand what you are trying to say here, but will not elaborate on it. God is all truth and I know the truth, and the truth has sometimes hurt me as I also believe it has hurt you. David, we know each other fairly well. You have an excellent of expressing your feelings on paper and even in pictures as evident in your myspace, but whatever happened to you to bring you to a loss of believing in Christianity I do not know, and will not even try to guess. I actually know that the traumas you suffered as a child can cause severe damage spiritually, emotionally, and mentally, as did some of my traumas me, but God has brought me through some of the deepest darkest valleys and now that I am on the other side, and hope to remain here for forever, I know that His intervention has made it possible for me to share what I have said here and earlier with you but as I am His, you too can be His fully if you want it. I don't know if you ever heard people say, when you were depressed, just pull yourself up by your bootstraps, but there were too many days in my life where I could not do it. I wish right now that I could say something that would be awe inspiring but all that I can think about is hoping that you could become free, free from whatever it is inside of you that torments your soul still. Hey man, God loves you and I know you know that, but what is inside can give us some of the worst feelings imaginable. I hope and pray that you will arrive at the WHOLE REAL TRUTH, AND COME TO KNOW YOUR SAVIOR IN A LIFE ALTERING WAY, ABLE TO STAND FIRM IN EVERYTHING THAT YOU DO. 2 Timothy 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17 so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work. As for the Abraham story, God provided a lamb without blemish just as He did when He sent Jesus to the cross for you and I. Jesus was the perfect sacrifice for all mankind and so God gave Him up for us. Isaac was not the perfect sacrifice, but it, the whole story, proved Abraham's belief/faith/trust in God to the fullest. God knew what Abraham would do, but without the story we don't have as much to go by when it comes to why we should believe in such an all-powerful Heavenly Father. once again in the Love of Christ, jim c.

David, if I didn't sense or know God is speaking to me to converse with you, I would give up, like you sorta said a couple of posts before. You basically said one of us would give up. I am sorry really sorry that you are like the man born blind. God removed scales or mud or whatever you want to call it after 40 years of crap from satan. I am not tormented anymore, period! I know the truth, speak the truth, and may get tired of trying to convince you of what is truly true. God though will not give up on you, unless you have hardened your heart as Pharaoh did. You see you fill up your paragraphs with way too many BIG words that almost want to fly over my head, but I know you even better than you know yourself. Neither of us have anybody attaching to what we are conversing about and I would truly wonder how many people would actually believe some of what you say here. I KNOW THAT THE VAST MAJORITY OF CHRISTIAN BELIEVERS WOULD HOLD TO WHAT I HAVE SAID AND DO SO WISELY. I know you are a good person with a good heart, but your doctrine is lacking in truth and clarity. Go ahead and believe what you may, but I won't. You sounded like in your last paragraph, that you believe in what Christians believe, but you have constantly tried to convey that you aren't one. Well, are you a Christian, or aren't you??? God Bless and good night, jim c.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=n-8SYA6rfbs EVER HAD TO DEAL WITH THIS

I posted my previous post before I realized that you responded. You want to know if I am Christian? When I already told you what I was? You people do that sort of thing all the time. It’s narrowly defined by you and only you or those who think like you. It’s a set-up by you. That you make the rules and that you can alter those rules as to what is what as you see fit. As if the Letter A is the alphabet but letters B through Z are not. And then say “See, I was right all the time, your not “A” so you’re not in the alphabet. What in the world does being called a Christian got to do with my faith? What did believers in Jesus call themselves before the Word “Christian” came into existence? It is trying the way you keep implying that English words and titles are the only acceptable words of faith. You are locked in your brain about it. And then say I use to many big words? Didn’t you imply that you worked as some kind of educator. An educator saying that I am too smart for him? That’s rich Jim and oh so terribly sad. My message is lacking in truth and Christian Charity? You say this like all hypocrites do. Make a claim then you don’t say how it is so. When I have done the opposite. Why do you pose emotional emptiness in place of substance. You are like the church that gives a homeless man a hug and a bible tract when he needs a meal, a shower, and a warm place to sleep. You are not being real again! Jim what did believers read or hear before the Bible came into existence. The Bible is only 400 years old! Scales before my eyes? HA! What about the pitch dark blackness you bumble around in? I tell you what God has shared with me for real. I am a man with real visions, dreams, hearing heavenly voices, angelic visitation, demonic battles, and healings. The things that happen to ME. Not what happened to someone else. The things that I experienced in MY life. What do you present? Emotional sentiments, whimpish assumptions of teachers that I could easily expose as fraudulent, and then you try and solicit some kind of psychological response from me with imagery from a song about a kid that is in an emotional quandary over her parents? Jim I am not that Kid! I don’t have any emotional links to saddened past that I never experienced. I fought my battles and still kept trucking, dude! What do you expect from me? Or you like the Churchy brain dead idiots that say things like “Don’t think about it, just believe”? Are you SERIOUS? You are afraid Jim. Aren’t you? You don’t want to wake up and smell the BS of religion. You want to wrap yourself up in the cocoons of their sweet lies. Because Jim, as the deadly poisons of it work through you, it lulls you to an euphoric sleepy stupor. And oh, it’s so nice, sooooo . . . . . . . . niiiiicccee to sleep the sleep of the undead. Isn’t Jim? And you want me there with you.

David is not Wiser Got does not talk. There is no heaven or hell. If there is, please tell me where. This thing about Christians can only be "saved" is nuts. When you die, you decompose. Wait a while and you will be bones only and maybe some hair. You say people have "souls." Oh yeah, what is it made of, similar to an implant in a breast? Ok, you say it is invisible. How come you can't see it. Does it burn if it is Jewish? Jesus Christ was born a Jew and died a Jew. The Bible was written by man. The Universe was created fifteen billion years ago and life began about four and a half billion years ago. I am open to comment.

Hello, Dan. I don’t understand the childish slight on my name, though. When I have never been anything but nice to you. It’s not even a very good one. But Good to hear from you again, anyway. My conversation with Jim, if you could call it that, was about Religion. Religion is not the same as a personal belief in God, a lot of people get it confused. Religion is an effort on the part of the believer to get a god to notice their contributions to a group effort and then expect that god to reward the acts of devotion and mutual bondings of that group. A practice I completely abhor. Because today the religious of the world have completely sacrificed personal faith and personal accountability and their own common sense, for that matter, all for a group agreement and acceptance to be led by a person or persons who will remove the burdens of accountability from them. It is actually faith in the group rather than their god or any idea of a god, when they say otherwise. It is very cowardly, in my opinon because individually they have no courage at all, to explain, or rationally discuss the attributes of their beliefs, or anything outside of that belief. They are in effect completely and mentally on auto-pilot. I am not one of those people. If you want to discuss that you believe that God does not existence you might find me and someone like Jim weirdly on the same side of that issue. I know, or believe, if you will that God does in fact exist because He has spoken to me on many occasions. If you like, you can assume that I am delusional about that, however it does not detract from the fact that it was an actual experience, delusional or otherwise, unlike Jim, I am being real about it. Got does not talk? Why do you believe that? Because He never talked to you. Well I know a guy name Steve that never talked to you. I guess that he means he never talked to anyone else? There is no heaven or hell? You see that is a religious error that you are trying to get me to defend. There is a heaven it is the sky, the solar system, and the galaxies of outer-space. I’ll bet you expected me to say something like white clouds and harps and pearly gates and things. LOL Hell is what I said earlier. The grave, death, non-existence, Nothingness. It is not fire and burning forever, that is religious error. This thing about Christians can only be "saved" is nuts? You are absolutely right. You get a prize. By definition the soul is the entity that keeps your body living. If I have to say what exactly for the lack of a better answer I would have to say the soul is a type of life-energy. But people have a mind and a spirit too. The mind is our capacity to process information into thoughts and ideas, the spirit is your personality. You asked “Ok, you say it (the soul) is invisible. How come you can't see it.” I never said it was anything until now, but Yes I believe it is invisible. But just because you can’t see something doesn’t mean that it isn’t there. Example: What does wind look like? I don’t know because I can’t see it. But it is there, because I can feel it. Does it burn if it is Jewish? Jesus Christ was born a Jew and died a Jew. Dan, that question makes no sense to me, Sorry man. You said, "The Bible was written by man." Yes it was, the first English Bible was written about 400 years ago, the words were altered on Command of the King so that He could legaly get a divorce from his wife without sinning. So he changed what the sin was in the book. More or less. The very first Bible was about 200 years or so before that but written in Latin and only the church elders were allowed to read it. Before there was any Bible at all Church Elders had hand-written copies of copies of various letters that may or may not have been written by the followers of Jesus' orginal twelve Apostles, not the Apostles themselves mind you, but their follwers. At best someone who never even heard Jesus preach, but heard someone else preach that he had heard Jesus preach. Anyway, the oldest copies are about 200 years after Jesus walked the earth. You said. “The Universe was created fifteen billion years ago and life began about four and a half billion years ago. I am open to comment.” I would have to agree with you on that. Science is very convincing on that topic. You asked, “How many eyes does a squirel have? How many ears? How many limbs? How many nostrils? How many toe nails? Should I say more? I asked a member of the Knights of Columbus once while discussing religion. I asked him where do squirrels go? He said: ‘Squirrel Heaven.’ ” I don’t understand the significance of those questions. Animals die just like we do. They don’t go anywhere. Just like we don’t. The religious error is that we go to heaven immediately after we die. We don’t. We stay in the ground until, as the Real Scriptures Teach, When God Resurrects us all. My grandfather died in 1988. He was cremated and his ashes scattered. And he is still scattered ashes today. His soul, which is just his life-energy was rendered inert when he died, and it is still inert right now. You asked “If there is a soul where do you draw the line between the haves and the have nots?” There is no difference between them, if I understand the question right. It sounds like your asking a spiritual question. Your last question was confusing and didn’t sound like a question all that much anyway. Have a good night, Dan Dave

Still there Jim? I hear you sleeping in your posts. You snore a lot. Typical auto-pilot mentality, Jim. You don’t throw a Bible verse out there and leave it hanging. Discuss it and tell us what it means. You see, Jim that is faith. That is discussing what you believe and why. Anything is else is displaying your idiocy and willingness to led around like a slave to anyone that flatters you. Before I continue, let me explain something of my education, you said on least one post that are some kind of teacher, I think you lied about that and I also think that it was really you posing as your son, You probably don't even have one. No matter. I am a high school drop out. I don’t have an education, but I am more learned and articulate than you, a self proclaimed teacher, appear to be. I do however have a 138 IQ. (Gifted still about 20 points from genius, though) These test are all over the internet, take one, if you get higher than a 95, I’ll be very surprised. All the stuff I learned I picked up over the years. I am self educated, and I read everything. Now as to your latest snore . . . errr . . . bore . . . I mean post. . . . Romans 18 was where Paul was Preaching to unconverted Romans who were worshiping multiple pagan gods and like your ilk today they never even really believed in those gods, do some research, they just did it because it was the socially acceptable thing, So, they were ready for something real, anyway. Romans 1:18 1st sentence. God’s anger. Is not anger. It’s correction. 2nd sentence is just fine the way it is, but it was worded with contempt for effect. When originally it wasn’t. 3rd sentence. Is not even in the Bible. But the writer of that post changed the words “the things made by God” to “God Himself” which is a SIN, by the way. Changing the words and not saying that you did, to explain a point. 4th sentence is so altered that I don’t where to start. 5th sentence is altered a great deal too but not as bad as the previous one. You posted “They knew God, but they did not give glory to God or thank him.” It is supposed to be in the Original context. When their “Ancestors” knew God, but they “taught” their descendants not to glorify Him as the true God, but as just another “Elohim” a created being. 6th sentence is supposed to be their “thoughts about God” but the passage only says thinking or thoughts. 7th sentence is supposed to be “Their foolish ideas” not “their foolish minds” 8th sentence is supposed to be “Your ancestors were wise about me (God) but taught you to be foolish about me )God) instead. See how the scribes of Europe who altered the words ever so slightly changed the entire outcome of the passage? Of course I could never do this in a church, I would be thrown out, even though it’s true, I would be Branded a heretic, less than 300 years ago I would have been murdered by them for it. But they would have murdered me out of LOVE for me, so that would have made it ok, at lest for them. Religion is wonderful you get to hate, malign, and judge, and condemn people to Hell as much as you want and if you live in a place that the law allows it, you can even kill, because someone else said that God said it was okay, just this once. But it never is just this once, is it, Jim? But luckily we live in a place where there is law against it. But you can murder me in your heart, and you get do it over and over and over. OHHH BOY! That’s fun for you.

Dave, I am sure you are a decent person. I read your e-mail. Thank you. If I wanted to cohesively communicate, I should print out the blog and reference while I share. Back to the soul. Yes, you can feel the wind but can you feel the soul? Again the "Creator" (or Energy, where I am leaning) preceded first life (asexual cells.) Energy "talks." You can hear and feel the wind. You can see a volcano erupting. You can watch the tides change. There is a litany. If Whatever caused creation of our universe (which I understand there may be more and that this would have to expand my thought prcess except for the fact that Energy, once again, comes to mind,) There is nothing scientific about a soul. Ask any doctor or surgeon or more appropriately a mortician. My point is that if there was a "God" involved, then nothing talked before life. Nature "talked," but no mouths existed at creation.

Dave, Very thoughtful. I am not sure how to respond. You made me think. My first reaction was that anything before the beginning of time, is not understandable. I do not believe in faith. I am well aware that it keeps most people going. When Jesus Christ was asked if he was King of the Jews, he returned: "It is you that say that I am." Only other news is that there are about 1,719,000 "Joes" in America.

Troube is I don't have hope for anything. Since I know now that there is no afterlife, what it there to hope for other than death? When I imagine outside of the Universe, I see total darkness.

Hey, David. I am sorry but I can't buy any of that. It's OK. Like my father used to say: "everybody to their own taste the lady said as she kissed the cow. My mother used to say never discuss politics or religion. All these thoughts have me into the depth of darkness, i.e., beyond the universe.

I was kicked out of church for charging my priest in college. He ended up telling me that I was right, none of this hocus pocus shit exitsts,.... it's just there for the idiots who can't figure out science, and for people who NEED GOD to get bye... I laughed my ass off and thanked him for finally coming clean as I called him a liar on my way out. Surprisingly he didn't yell back,..... "YOU ARE RUINING IT FOR THE CHILDREN."

This movie was so retarded! Produced by a bunch of negative atheists hoping they are right in the end...live it up tards!

Sammmaa, maybe you should read a first grade science book. There is no evidence of any god anywhere. Maybe if you read said book your could answer some of your own questions.

There is no purpose whatsoever for being here except for staying alive, if you so choose. Maybe we are here for happiness? Now accepting comments.

I wish this blog would pick up some action. The last blog before Sammmaa was thirteen days before hers.

The movie is interesting but juvenile. What can you expect from a comic and the creator of Borat? Maybe Maher needs the money and is just making something that will sell but destruction of what sustains folks without replacing it with something better is not a real contribution. Try to imagine (seriously over many decades) what the world would be like without any religion, without any of the contributions made by religions. THere are answers to the dilemmas he poses but you have to think a bit. I predict a time will come when folks return to their religious roots despite his ridicule because there is more to a religion than just the superficial entertainment.

In the movie "Religulous" Bill Maher asks "Why doesn't God just obliterate the Devil therefor getting rid of evil?" The answer is this, if God were to obliterate Satan many people believe it or not would think that God couldn't handle all the trouble Satan was causing when in fact God could handle anything. So by showing that He could handle anything he will let Satan loose on the earth just so that he could show people like Bill Maher that He will always be stronger, greater, and forevermore powerful.